A man's world?

Born in 1942 in western Germany, Alice Schwarzer is one of the country's leading feminists. She began her career as a journalist and has since published a number of books on women's issues. She is currently the editor-in-chief and publisher of Emma, a magazine written from a feminist perspective. She talked with Deutsche Welle about her career and the direction of women's rights after the recent publication of her autobiography.

Deutsche Welle: Alice Schwarzer, I think it's fair to say that you are one of the most disputed women in Germany. And not just with men but also women - interestingly, also from within the women's movement. What kind of objections do you hear from those in the movement?

Alice Schwarzer: If we women were all in agreement - we are 52 percent of the world population - then we wouldn't have to talk about all this nonsense at all. An American feminist said at the beginning of the 1970s that the first step for the women's movement is reconciliation with women. Not with men. Women simply have a tradition of rivalry and competitiveness that goes back thousands of years. For the woman, every other female was a threat to her standing with the husband she depended on. And since their sex was oppressed for so long and still is to an extent, the self-hatred that resulted from that was also projected toward other women.

But in terms of the women's movement, there was a broad spectrum even from the beginning. There were diverse positions. And only at the very start did these differences remain under the surface. Later came, for instance, the leftist feminists who said that class war is the most important thing - that that's how the conflict between the sexes arose at all. Or there were lesbian groups who said that homosexuality is the strategy for liberation and that heterosexuality is traitorous.

In Germany in particular there was a very dogmatic women's movement. Of course, that's bound up with German tradition. The whole leftist scene was also very dogmatic. And when I returned from Paris, that really shocked me - this insistence on right-wrong, black-white, enemy-friend. I wasn't used to that from Paris. The women's movement there had a lot of rather anarchist tendencies. We had no specific agenda, and we took pleasure in the contradictions. I got offended pretty quickly.

There were some weighty emotions at sake, and I wonder how you were able to deal with it all.

You're right to say that. The attacks from outside can be quite uncomfortable, definitely. I come on the scene, shake the pillars, and question tradition. Of course I'm going to deal with some anger. But real pain, of course, only comes from within. That was very difficult for me. After my book "Der kleine Unterschied und seine großen Folgen" ("The Little Difference and Its Huge Consequences"), which deals with the function of sexuality and love in terms of the power relationship between the sexes - a topic which is once again very relevant - I withdrew immediately into my work.

I'm always being called the "voice of the women's movement." The poor women's movement (laughs)! It has a lot of voices, and it's definitely wrong to suggest that it speaks with just one. People were right to protest against that. In reality, I was always just a lone wolf who sought out compatriots to bring about certain things and actions.

You have had an impact. Many girls have been named Alice or Emma, the title of your magazine. You have, it's safe to say, changed the world a little bit internationally. Is there now a solid basis for women's emancipation or do you have that feeling that we're seeing setbacks?

Wherever there is great progress, there are also setbacks. And the relationship between men and women has gotten more complicated. When we started in the 1970s, women weren't even allowed to have their own career. When they were in Germany's Federal Parliament - if they were there at all - they couldn't wear pants (laughs). That's hardly even imaginable today. A lot of things have happened, and we have brought about incredible successes. Certainly the women's movement is the social movement that has achieved the most in the 20th and early 21st centuries. But precisely these successes sometimes conceal the dangers.

I look on with concern as our entire culture becomes pornographized. Now I don't understand pornography as eroticism but rather the deep coupling of sexual lust with lust for power and debasement. At the same time, sex researchers have highlighted the trend toward a more communicative sexuality between men and women - that is, a more equitable, mutual sexuality. Both phenomena stand side by side.

There is the religious fundamentalism. And the Islamists are way ahead there, but Christians are catching up. And it's no accident that women's basic human rights are the first to get targeted. The progress we have achieved is not safeguarded, and we have to watch out for that.

What advice would you have for young women today?

Don't want to be loved at any price! Be open to conflict! That is very important. And in the places where women and men are together, stand up for your rights. Career women, quotas and all - that's all great, and I am for it. We also support it heavily in the magazine Emma. But it's just as important to take an interest in and engage in the world beyond your own interests. Lead a meaningful life: That's what's really fun!

Interview: Gabriela Schaaf / gsw
Editor: Kate Bowen